Brooklyn Lowry (00:07.534)
Thanks for tuning into the Healthy Project Podcast, My City, My Health series. I am your host for this year, Brooklyn Lorie, and I am joined today by Jasmine Brooks. Jasmine, why don't you give us a little introduction about yourself?

Jazzmine Brooks (00:23.826)
man, where do I start? I am a certified doula here in central Iowa. I provide a lot of various supports as well as really attending births, doing childbirth ed classes. I do a bit of yoga in the community as well as consult and do speaking engagements about Black maternal and infant mortality.

equity and wellness and all those other things. My full -time job is in food security work. I work for Iowa Healthiest State Initiative to bring more fresh fruits and vegetables to Iowans across the state through the Double Up Food Bucks program. So lots and lots of things on my plate.

Brooklyn Lowry (01:08.078)
Okay, yeah. Do you wanna touch more on what GI all live wellness is? And correct me if I'm wrong.

Jazzmine Brooks (01:15.442)
Yeah, yeah, J olive. Yeah, J olive wellness. So I moved to Iowa and got married. And of course, part of the conversation is, are you having kids? And when are you having kids? And we were like, pump your breaks. We want to go back to school and all these other things before we start talking about children. But it gave me a chance to, if anything, talk through mental health because

Growing up in Southside Chicago, I call it the Las Vegas, Nevada home. I'm now stuck in this very rural white place of Iowa and really having to navigate resources and just overall healthcare needs, knowing that I don't have access to people who look like me. I didn't know where we went and what was making sense. So J Olive Wellness started as a podcast just like this.

where I shared my experiences navigating mental health and other healthcare resources. The relationships that were changed just really wanted to give perspectives. I felt like that type of voice was not out there at the time that I could find. And I ended up getting connected with, at my job, I was working at Iowa State at the time and found out about the Black maternal mortality.

And something just inside of me based off of where I was in that time of my life, I cut all my hair off and went down to Atlanta, get trained as a doula. And the hair part I bring up because it was just this reckoning. Reckoning as a Black, I was already natural, but I think I needed that push, right? So I went down there, got gathered all the way up by all these beautiful Black women that I still hold dear to me.

Brooklyn Lowry (02:50.51)
We all go through that.

Jazzmine Brooks (03:06.322)
and came back and was like, I'm about to do this and I don't have no kids. Like, what does this look like? So Jail Wellness is now a nonprofit. I can say that. And so really trying to increase access to resources, direct services to families. I'll be sharing about our mobile clinic because we'll be up and running by the time my city, my health will be. And so, yeah, I'm just excited for the growth.

and just the opportunity to bring more resources to my community.

Brooklyn Lowry (03:41.934)
Yeah, first of all, I love that you mentioned cutting all your hair off because like I said, we do all go through that. And I recently just cut, I cut, I didn't shave it, but I did cut a good amount of it off, but I wasn't natural.

Jazzmine Brooks (03:48.626)
Thank you.

It's a fake.

Jazzmine Brooks (03:59.442)
It was gone. All of it was gone. Hair follicles looking like straight up Pickett Smith out here. Like it was like, it was gone.

Brooklyn Lowry (04:02.03)
Yeah.

my goodness. Well, I'm happy that you were able to from that also have that be in your journey and build a amazing group of Black women with you. That's awesome. I'm sure your journey has or just your outlook on it mental health wise and Black maternal wise has changed from before you had kids to now. So how?

Jazzmine Brooks (04:31.666)
Mm -hmm. Yeah. Yeah. So I actually miscarried. So I would say I'm a mom to an angel baby. But I would say even just in the past year, it's changed. I walked in with this complex that I didn't really realize was, you know, forming of I need to be out here saving people.

Brooklyn Lowry (04:34.83)
Has that changed?

Jazzmine Brooks (04:57.554)
I think, you know, they talk to you about that and particularly in black doula training. I felt like I didn't get that in other doula trainings, but when there was a black woman facilitating it, she talked about how this work, if you do it right, it puts a mirror up to who you are and you have to, you have to reckon with whatever is looking back at you. And I would say, you know, I've had a lot of great birthing experiences and I've had a lot of challenging birthing experiences.

But what I do leave with is this understanding of how we show up for mothers, particularly Black birthing people, how we show up for them in the boardroom, in policy spaces, in direct services. I've been fortunate to help train other doulas, mentor other doulas. And so that's changed my perspective about how do I equip them to support families. My language has changed, right?

Brooklyn Lowry (05:55.918)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (05:57.746)
how I communicate the work has changed. And then, you know, now having the experience of a pregnancy loss, it gives me a new found respect for like the ways in which black women, particularly in rural places, particularly the places that are underserved that are low in access to clinical

preventative care really shows us the work we still have to do. We've come a long way, but I would say that in some ways I feel we're regressing and having those direct experiences impact the way that I show up today for.

Brooklyn Lowry (06:40.014)
Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (06:50.862)
So that's a very sensitive topic to talk about. And I'm very sorry for your loss. I think that if there's at any point, if you're not comfortable talking about that, you can let me know. But I think that we don't talk about how black women are inversely affected by miscarriage. And I think that I'm

Jazzmine Brooks (06:54.482)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

thing.

Jazzmine Brooks (07:02.29)
Yeah, I'm good now.

Jazzmine Brooks (07:15.826)
Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (07:19.758)
curious as to what those services looked like for you, how you were able to access them, if they could be better, what could be better?

Jazzmine Brooks (07:33.477)
You know, so let me know if I get too political, I try not to, but I feel the abortion conversation shows up very uniquely in our experience. I think we are missing out on a big chunk of what resources look like when we are cutting out abortion access. When this conversation became eroded

with the craziness that it is right now was the time that I found out I was miscarrying, but I had not miscarried. And so I had to make a decision or was left with the only decision if I did not formally miscarry that I would have to leave the state in order to get the services I needed because they would not be here. And that was...

Brooklyn Lowry (08:24.846)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (08:26.258)
the scariest, most craziest conversation to have with yourself of like, you're telling me if I go to the doctor right now and my baby has not left my body, that you would not be able to do anything for me. And I could potentially die because now a fetus is demised. So it's like, what do you do? What do you do? And I had nowhere to go. I...

I miscarried at home. A doula, the rural black doula miscarried at home because I did not feel safe going to the hospital. I did not feel like I was going to be treated with care. As far as knowing the resources, a lot of it was my own network of community. And that is such, that is the heartbeat of the work, right? Is we think healthcare is it, yeah, healthcare can definitely be

be way better at providing services. And also we need to reconcile with how have we completely tore down networks and communities of support for Black women. Because if I didn't have the people that I had around me, I probably would not be well today. Knowing that I had to, I was already on counseling, already in counseling, so I had that support. I can reason with the fact that if,

finding a counselor is very difficult, let alone a counselor equipped to talk through fertility laws. I would say family, people just being so unaware of like what that experience is like. Even in pregnancy, the conversations people have, you're just an incubator, right? Like it was less about how are you doing, but how's the baby? And then the way it

just helps build up this complex that you don't matter. And it's like, whoa, wait a minute. And so when we're talking about access to resources, what questions are we asking the families? How are they feeling? Not noting things on the documentation that will create challenges for them later. That was another thing. Like my...

Jazzmine Brooks (10:48.658)
fertility clinic, my first one had noted a mental health observation that they had. And so I had to have a conversation with them about that is not your job and you are not formally equipped to even comment on that. And that's not even what anxiety was for me. That was me having like breathing patterns to help calm me down because you're so rough, right?

Brooklyn Lowry (11:16.11)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (11:17.714)
And so my big thing now that encouraged me to start looking at what postpartum care is even means. Cause like we got all these birth do's out here and we don't have enough clearly, but then what are we doing postpartum for parents? And that was the biggest journey I had. I had postpartum depression, even infertility loss. We don't talk about that either. Like how your body is still acting as if it carried a baby.

So what does that feel like for black women, specifically women of color too, like the stigma around that. And so having to carry that weight, I'll be honest with you, I'm in a privileged position. I was able to go home, I was able to travel, I was able to get myself together and use everything at my disposal. So I'll be honest, if somebody didn't have anything that I had, I would imagine they would have had a very rough time and continue to have a rough time.

because they did not have the support, the anchor that they needed to be able to feel the love and care to get back to a new part of who they would be knowing that this loss happened. Because the thing is, do I go back to who I was? And that's a stigma too. It's like, no, I am now a whole new person and how do I even get to know this person after this happened?

Brooklyn Lowry (12:34.222)
Yeah. Yeah. So to me, it's like maternal care is the umbrella. And there's so much more than that. It's pre post mom, baby health care beyond services than just that. Yeah, then just that small generalization, which is crazy because

Jazzmine Brooks (12:53.266)
So that's what we're doing here.

Brooklyn Lowry (13:02.83)
It just shows how much we lack as a healthcare system and so much more beyond that. And I do want to say, don't ever apologize for wanting to be too political because this is your personal journey. And I think that when you share your personal journey unapologetically, that it's you and no one can tell you otherwise. This is what you experience.

Jazzmine Brooks (13:21.618)
Yes.

Jazzmine Brooks (13:30.13)
I mean, our politics are not separate from our identities, to be honest. And so there's no way for me to speak about without a political side for sure.

Brooklyn Lowry (13:38.67)
Yeah.

Brooklyn Lowry (13:43.374)
Yeah, yeah. And especially after what you've gone through because of what you had to experience and how the laws in place really affected your journey. It's understandable why this would be also important to touch on. And I can't imagine your mental health going through this. my goodness.

Jazzmine Brooks (13:49.202)
Hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (14:09.066)
Yeah, dark, dark day.

Brooklyn Lowry (14:09.678)
Yeah, I mean...

Yes. How were mental health services looking for you? And how did that kind of... How did you... How do I ask this? Lean into your community. Was that a thing? Like leaning more into your community to kind of focus on your mental health.

Jazzmine Brooks (14:24.37)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (14:36.754)
That's a great question. I would say the beginning, it was isolating. I think I had to isolate. I felt like no one understood. No one could comprehend or reason with what I was going through and how it felt. I think everyone wants to approach this as positive and affirming and that you'll be okay, but you don't really.

Brooklyn Lowry (14:42.478)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (15:04.786)
hear that, you're not digesting that. Like, it's a loss, a significant loss, regardless if it's, you know, earlier, later, like, I felt it. And I think that's the piece of it too, is that spiritual attuning that I have to my body is that I, I felt it and I knew before I even got the test results. And I wasn't even like, concerned or worried. I had a very positive outlook, was very,

excited and just looking forward to, you know, doing all the things to prepare. Right. And so I can't remember when, but I ended up the first time I was able to even like open up was when I took a trip for a week by myself. And I had done that in the past, but like to truly just be with myself.

intentionally. I think that's the key part intentionally. To just spend time with me again. I did not let my husband in for some time. My counselor, I have a great counselor. I've had a relationship with her for the past five or so years and so sitting with her was great. I ended up getting a second counselor to specifically go through like our changes and challenges as a married couple.

I think people don't know how to navigate mental health resources. I do recognize that for sure. Cause when folks ask me like, how do I decide on a mental health counselor? I'm like, it's not just that it's, it's like, what are they doing with you? And what I didn't want was to be going in there crying all the time, complaining, like it's not serving me. I feel like a weight is not lifting. I feel like I'm not getting clarity. You're not giving me homework. And so thankfully I had a counselor that did all those things for me.

Brooklyn Lowry (16:49.806)
Yeah.

Jazzmine Brooks (17:03.89)
She gave me perspective. She helped me anchor myself in more tools for clarity. There are books that I read. I'm reading a book right now called Courage to Be Disliked, because I didn't realize how much wrapped up I was in all these other things that I thought mattered at the time, that to me today do not matter. I was like, am I worried about this stuff and this is holding me down? And I'm like, my baby taught me so much about myself, so much.

that I, back then I would say, my God, I can't breathe, to you gave me a new breath. Like, I'm breathing a new type of air and I'm so deserving of that. And we'll love the next attempt and hopefully birth of a child, right? But it's like, even in those moments, you're just like, I can't do this again. Like.

What does this mean if we get further? Like all these things go through your mind and people just don't understand. Like you can be present all day, you can show up, you can be gracious, like you can be patient. But man, those lashing out moments, I mean, duck and hide. Like, I mean, I didn't even wanna take care of my plants. Like that's how bad my babies, my...

Brooklyn Lowry (18:24.43)
Yeah.

Jazzmine Brooks (18:30.77)
my po babies. I had dogs. I wouldn't got another dog who does that. But like I wanted to care of something. So I went and got a corgi. Don't do that. I love Bree, but I'm like, man, I got her out of pain. And now she's here. I love her. She's my shadow, which is such a godsend because she is like, she's my little protector. Now I have my older dog who's my protector, but she is.

Brooklyn Lowry (18:31.118)
Oof.

Brooklyn Lowry (18:36.014)
I'm sorry.

Yeah.

Brooklyn Lowry (18:46.478)
Yeah, but she's lovely.

Jazzmine Brooks (19:01.138)
she's my fierce protector. Like everybody got catch hands if you mess with mommy. So I was like, that protection was fun and exciting to bring in the house. But I think, I think sometimes I think about how unprotected I am. And then, you know, that moment, it was like, man, that was, I've had these traumatic experiences in my life, but that was like,

Brooklyn Lowry (19:06.734)
Yeah.

Jazzmine Brooks (19:28.562)
I mean, the epicenter of unprotected that I felt and it was like what you do now. So.

Brooklyn Lowry (19:36.669)
Yeah, I mean you bring such a different perspective to the table I feel like because we also talk so much about leaning into people which is one aspect that is so important but I think it's also important to note that when you go through such a hardship that at the end of the day a lot of it is just stuff you experience yourself.

And no one is able to reach into your brain and fully understand what it is that you go through. And so just having those services to at least help you navigate the rest of your personal journey is very important. And I appreciate you so much for sharing that with us.

Jazzmine Brooks (20:27.186)
Yeah.

Brooklyn Lowry (20:30.67)
Were you certified as a doula and a lactation specialist before or after you had experienced this?

Jazzmine Brooks (20:43.506)
way before, way before. So this, this happened last year, but I had, I've been a doula for six years in August. So yeah.

Brooklyn Lowry (20:45.518)
Okay.

Brooklyn Lowry (20:53.166)
So do you think that the education and like understanding or knowledge in that realm also changed how you navigated?

Jazzmine Brooks (21:06.258)
I mean, making that decision to stay home, that was that was the decision for my partner and I, right? Like I knew we I had and he's he I would say he's a doula to write because he's been with all my clients when we particularly during covid when it was like we couldn't be at nobody house. So even him, like paying attention to certain things and me already sharing with him, like this is when you would want to call an ambulance if like this happens, like

being very aware and educated about the process and the practice is huge, because I am a fertility doula as well. So I am trained to teach like reproductive health and sexual health. So it's just like, I already know my body enough, like very, like more than most people. And so I'm aware of like what should, shouldn't be happening. I knew what to drink. I knew.

what to eat to recover. I knew that's why I went vegan for four months. So after I miscarried, I went vegan for four months just to really help re -regulate my body into a state of wound that allowed me to be open. Cause if I had been eating poorly, I probably wouldn't have survived. Like food is like our home state. Like if we're able to put things into our body to help us, it really helps provide that anchor. So I already knew.

Brooklyn Lowry (22:24.91)
Yeah.

Jazzmine Brooks (22:28.946)
like what I needed to be doing now. Was it easy every day? No, I think people think doulas can doula themselves. No, it's not as easy as it sounds like, cause you have your moments where I'm not about to do this. I'm not about to do this. And I would say, cause it's calling me right now to say when using services, I think people think people need to be grateful. Like I...

was always met with, well, at least you have, or I'm giving you this, why is that not enough? And it's like, that's nothing to do with you. If I use that resource or that idea or eat that food or do this, like, provide this to me and then hands off, right? Because it is overwhelming. You're overloaded with things. And then you want me to hear you and listen to you and...

give me all these things and I need to reconcile that and put whatever I got to the side that's going on for that moment or that day to like listen to you and do what you say. And it's like, that's not possible. Like any type of resource in any scenario can be overloading to people. And so I wish folks would have said, what do you need right now? Like in this moment, what would get you to a place where you could

Brooklyn Lowry (23:33.614)
Yeah.

Jazzmine Brooks (23:49.714)
feel comfortable sitting still or taking advantage of this service? What's prohibiting you from doing X, Y, and Z? Yeah, I was just like, these are all the things I can do now, then what's the first thing I do versus what's the next thing or the fifth thing? It is overloading sometimes. But thankfully, for me and my experience, I was able to know like,

take this step by step, let your body recover, then go to the next thing, whatever that next thing that is pulling you. And so I think I'm finally able to not cry just thinking about my kid, right? Like that I can just be open to just feeling their spirit as I continue to move through this work. But I would say back then it was like, for now I can't do anything.

and I shouldn't do anything. Like I stopped school. It was a lot. I had to stop and sit still and that was not easy.

Brooklyn Lowry (24:59.022)
Yeah. So staying on the topic of you being a doula, what Black maternal issues have you sought to impact the most? And can you kind of share your, excuse me, can you kind of share your successes within that?

Jazzmine Brooks (25:07.41)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (25:25.874)
Yeah, I would say increasing the presence of Black doulas in the state. I initially started with a few Black doulas. We were all kind of in different counties. And since then, you know, increasing the presence of different trainings, I think it was...

I thought was a challenge to only be trained by a certain body, particularly a body that did not like highlight or respect black maternal mortality in the first place. And so being trained by black midwives, like all my training has been by a black midwife. I was like, this is important. And so since then we've increased and I can only speak for Polk County, which where I serve as the liaison for

having more Black doulas be present. We also started a doula program that serves migrant immigrant refugee families. And having that dual -lingual, like multi -language, like opportunity for families that may not have access to doulas. So not just serving Black families, but serving families in general that have

the most displacement are resettling here after coming from a place of conflict. These people are vulnerable as well. And so that's what Black women do, right? Is like we piece, we do what we do for ourselves and then we start to have these other anchoring points, these other communities. And so that's been the biggest piece of just increasing that presence of doulas that speak multiple language. Because again, Blackness is also not monolithic.

I've served Black, you know, Black identifying families that speak Spanish or their families speak Spanish, right? So it's really thinking about like, what other things could we be doing to help bring more families in? We've also, I provided childbirth education for free for families that speak multiple languages, including Black families. So we call it Black and Berthie. So that's been going for the past two years. I can say, I don't know if it's too much, but

Jazzmine Brooks (27:46.066)
I got a grant to expand that to the community to work with community service providers that are in the Asian Pacific Islander community and the Latinx community and refugee community. Like how can we expand this education of childbirth ed to families? And then also really helping to engage people around postpartum.

What was nice about the doulas we just recently trained is they're trained not only in birth, but in postpartum. So we combined everything together so that they have the entire experience in one. So that was a week long training that we provided. And I think it set them up for success for sure, because I do see a uniqueness in how they show up and how they look at it from a business mindset.

Because I always talk about like Dulish, it isn't just about providing the families, but this is an economic benefit, right? You are not only providing education to the families in those communities, but you are creating an entrepreneur that can help recycle the dollar in their community, right? By providing direct services, we're also training the people in those communities to do the work. We're not trying to infiltrate, bring random people in that don't live there.

that they don't know, like it again, it's doing the work of training people within those communities, provide those services and giving them the support. So part of my job is also to provide professional development. So we meet regularly through Dula Huddles to talk about different concepts, to help them engage around different things. So we talk about gestational diabetes. They got a big training on preeclampsia. We gave them cuffs to do blood pressure, right?

All those things I've had, I wouldn't say the word fight for, but it really was about engaging the state and the service providers to know like, it isn't just about me helping someone deliver a baby, but there's all these other pieces to it and really helping to like situate what doula work is. Because it's always about like what doula work isn't, well, you can't catch a baby, you can't do this, you can't do this. I've done so many other things that matter that has shown impact.

Brooklyn Lowry (29:59.822)
Thank you.

Jazzmine Brooks (30:05.618)
and the health outcomes of families and children.

Brooklyn Lowry (30:08.974)
Yeah. And I just think, I think people look for people that look like them. So it's so important to serve as more representation for underrepresented, underrepresented communities. And even going into the community level and not

Jazzmine Brooks (30:18.45)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (30:33.042)
Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (30:38.478)
not infiltrating, I like that you used that term, but educating the people already there to then further spread those resources and that education is amazing. And just moving on from that, looking at the conference that you'll be joining us for in the Black Maternal Health Panel.

Jazzmine Brooks (30:38.738)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (30:49.138)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (31:04.686)
What specific issues are you hoping to be able to touch on?

Jazzmine Brooks (31:11.282)
Yeah, I think there definitely needs to be some conversation about the postpartum expansion and kind of how that impacts the work that we're doing and how we're showing up. I think posing the question to the community, the attendees about where do they see themselves in this work? I mean, we've been talking about Black maternal mortality in the state, I would say, since COVID. And so have they seen?

progress. And then asking the next hard question is, do you feel the community feels that progress? Right? Because I think there's a lot of protective mechanisms that hospitals do because now it's like, let's reduce the risk of getting sued. And that's the easy route, right? I would say keeping lawsuits down. But

Brooklyn Lowry (31:51.182)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (32:08.274)
we go back to the, not just the health outcomes, but the experience of birth. I think we misrepresent addressing black maternal mortality when we just reduce it to health outcomes. So if asking these survey questions, these are great, but I also want to know how is this person experiencing their pregnancy, their birth, when they go to the hospital to do their prenatal appointments, when they get any exams, when they

Brooklyn Lowry (32:21.55)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (32:37.17)
are looking for resources, referrals when they're getting case management services. I want to know, do they know what those experience look and feel like? And are they getting the help that they need? And I think too, as we think about continued community engagement, baby showers and those types of things, I think those things are great. The question is, why does someone need a stroller? Why don't they just have one? And what barrier is causing that?

We need to look at jobs, right? Payment options, people being able to afford things, groceries are high, they're high. Formula, Pampers, diapers, wipes, everything is expensive. And so part of that access is to really look at all the other pieces that are really creating.

Brooklyn Lowry (33:09.006)
Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (33:20.302)
period.

Jazzmine Brooks (33:33.298)
more pressure for a family to just be able to be a family. And it's hard, right? Because like the conversation is around healthcare and I'm here for that. And also what I'm realizing too is these families don't have access to healthy foods, which is a huge impact to not only reproductive health, their pregnancy, but their postpartum too. Like food matters. Having a safe place to live matters.

Brooklyn Lowry (33:36.942)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (34:01.586)
having a healthy relationship matters, being able to afford childcare matters, right? I can sit here and be a doula all day, but guess what? My conversations with my families, I barely can get a conversation in about stages of labor these days. I'm having to talk with families about substance abuse, about how can they afford to stay home because they can't afford childcare, they can't find adequate childcare. I'm having to address all these other things. So as much as being a doula is great,

We really haven't come to our family. It is barely sometimes about delivery and that's the

Brooklyn Lowry (34:37.198)
Yeah, yeah. And it's so much more than just numbers beyond the healthcare sense. And I think that that's really important to touch on. And you just using your voice has already and will already make such an impact. Because me not having, me not being,

Jazzmine Brooks (34:44.082)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (34:47.538)
Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (35:05.07)
as educated in that realm, it means a lot and it goes so much further when you express knowledge like this because it's not talked about and that's why a lot of people, including myself, don't know that it's so much more beyond that. How do you think organizations and people like myself

Jazzmine Brooks (35:18.514)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (35:24.882)
Mm -hmm.

Brooklyn Lowry (35:32.334)
can get more involved in initiatives focused on just the entirety of maternal health.

Jazzmine Brooks (35:41.106)
Yeah, I'll be honest. I'll say the honest. I will always be honest. We love recreating stuff because it makes us look good. And if that is how people approach it, then you shouldn't do it. That's how I truly feel. There is enough programs out here that are currently serving families that have doula projects. We don't need a thousand doula projects. We don't. Right. But how can you currently use the doulas that are present in this community that have

Brooklyn Lowry (36:04.366)
Mm.

Jazzmine Brooks (36:11.314)
been working hard to build relationships. They are paid to do outreach, so they're already engaged in so many different ways. How can you maximize their relationship building and uplift their work by donating to covering families, services to families? A lot of families don't qualify for some of these programs. And I think we miss out on a big chunk of community members that are allowing to have doulas like.

doula's, doula care is still not accessible or affordable to people. And so how are you building programs that allow for doulas to be paid for their time, offering childbirth ed classes, offering doula support, offering time for doulas to come in to share about what they do and how they can serve communities, you know, educating people on what doulas even do in the first place and why they exist.

I think is so vital and important because it helps us, it helps us knock down those walls that prohibit us from coming into certain spaces because doula work is not translatable in a lot of different communities. They call them different things. They are seen differently. And a lot of indigenous communities, Latinx communities were looked at as midwives, right? So like, but I'm not a midwife in this country. I have to have formal degrees in those types of things. So.

really helping to anchor what opportunities are for doulas. I think the other piece I would say is get like teaching people advocacy and empowerment. Like how can they help in navigating their resources? Don't just hand them a piece of paper and just hope that they go and look at their doctor's notes. Like really talk to people about their results. Talk to people about the next step or next phase of their care.

Brooklyn Lowry (38:07.086)
Mm -hmm.

Jazzmine Brooks (38:08.018)
posing questions to them if they don't have questions. And really, again, helping to build agency. We cannot do this work if people don't feel comfortable and confident, you know, standing up for themselves, declining certain things, asking questions. I think that's the big part of our job as doulas is helping to prep people for their appointments. And I think it shows a different level of like how they show up for themselves.

when they feel confident. Cause then I see that how I see how they show that up for their child once they're done with me, right? They're like, yeah, my doctor was holding my baby a certain way and normally my mom was like, let it go. And I was like, no, I don't want to let it go. Or my blood pressure was continuing to be high. And then I kept like fighting for it and found out I had post -predeclampsia. Like that's so important to the work is not only providing this support for doulas.

Brooklyn Lowry (39:07.118)
Thank you.

Jazzmine Brooks (39:07.474)
both in just people feeling confident in their own health and taking ownership of their health for sure.

Brooklyn Lowry (39:15.79)
Yeah, and being vocal about it too. Yeah. So just uplifting the organizations and the resources that I already hear for our benefit so that they can get more outreach rather than creating the same duplicate organizations with the same amount of outreach.

Jazzmine Brooks (39:18.514)
Yeah.

Jazzmine Brooks (39:42.418)
Dula projects are intense. They require a lot of time, a lot of personnel, a lot of mentoring. And I think for particularly every step, we have found a smooth way of managing it. We have a ton of Dulas, and so it's not easy providing the level of support that we have created. And because we've already been doing this for five or so years, it's like,

Yeah, let's not reinvent the wheel here. Like, let's use the doulas that are there because they are, people don't know, but like they are private doulas. They're not just beholden to every step. Like I work, I'm a doula with Molina, right? And I take my own private clients as well. So we, we have the ability to work in different programs. There's YWRC that has a doula project. So

really helping to support some of these projects that are currently supporting the community and surrounding counties, like let's do that for sure.

Brooklyn Lowry (40:50.926)
Mm -hmm, yeah. Well, thank you so much, Jasmine, for your time. Is there anything else that you would like to touch on before we see you at the conference?

Jazzmine Brooks (40:55.218)
Yeah, absolutely.

Jazzmine Brooks (41:02.61)
Yeah, no, I'm just excited. I think, you know, this will be a great opportunity for people to engage, you know, four years later about, you know, a really important continuing, evolving discussion around how do we show up? How have people shown up already? What ways do we still need to work to rebuild towards a better perinatal health care system?

that sees all and supports all in an equitable way. And I think that that is where we need to land with this, separating the ego, separating the, we need this type of money in this place. Like, let's have some truthful conversations about where we're at and where we need to be going.

Brooklyn Lowry (41:57.742)
Well, thank you so much, Jasmine, for your time. And I am excited to see you at the My City, My Health Conference.

Jazzmine Brooks (42:04.818)
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Brooklyn Lowry (42:06.734)
And thank you for tuning in.